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Vanessa Carlton => General Vanessa Carlton Discussion => Topic started by: NoelleNC on August 14, 2005, 08:51:30 pm
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Of all V's songs I've tried to play, I think Papa gave me the most trouble. I play by ear and I can't seem to hear exactly what she's doing to try to mimic it. I gave up after a little while and might start it up again, but it did give me a little bit of a hard time.
Are there any harder, though? I haven't tried to play all her songs. I thought Half A Week sounded really hard until I learned it and it's not too bad.
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Umm Papa is pretty damn hard. I agree. And Winter is tough for me, but I have most of it. The only part I can't play is that insanely impossible breakdown piano thingie. I don't know how to describe it.
Oh and I've found Sway and Unsung to be difficult to play and sing at the same time... But that's about it.
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Umm Papa is pretty damn hard. I agree. And Winter is tough for me, but I have most of it. The only part I can't play is that insanely impossible breakdown piano thingie. I don't know how to describe it.
Oh and I've found Sway and Unsung to be difficult to play and sing at the same time... But that's about it.
the breakdown paino thingy? You mean after
The vampires are growing tired
The coats of white all turn to red
My heart burns with desire
I carry on, I carry on
That part is kinnnnnd of easy, I just went encredibly slow and took my time, when I got it, but everytime i seem to miss two of the C's
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she said a song called Quarryllude or anything like that is the hardest song she has ever written. The bad thing is that we've never heard the song
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apparently blue ditty is so hard that she can't even play it :?
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apparently blue ditty is so hard that she can't even play it :?
haha lmao.... :lol:
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-well, i'ma have to warn you that this post may be a long one, but hang in there. it might help you figure out how to play 'PAPA'.
-when i first learned the song, i absolutely just sot there at the piano in my local music building, b/c i didn't know what the hell i was doing at first, b/c i wasn't really that familiar with the key of Eb Minor, which has 6 flats. [i guess that's synonymous with Eb Dorian].
-slowly, but surely, i began to catch on to the song. i don't know how, but i began to get it, even though i had the notes wrong at first. but i did correct it later on, b/c sometimes i get to the point when i'm playing the notes, and then say to myself, that 'this don't sound right', and then i correct my mistake. the same thing happened i learned 'A Thousand Miles' about a month ago.
-but the only problem is that i there's a part [i don't know exactly what measure] where i'm still having problems with the notes. but guess what i found out? that there's room for improvisation in the song, b/c Van doesn't play it on Sessions@AOL like she doesn't on the album. it's a little different, and she plays it faster. so i did the same thing.
-it's only the first page of the song that i printed out from Musicnotes.com, since i don't have the songbook yet, b/c i think that's the more accrate version. i thought that i had the conclusion of the song down at first, [by ear] but decided that something didn't sound right. i ran the CD back and found out what my mistake was, so i corrected it, so now i have to redo it.
-so far that song's is the fastest and most difficult song i've encountered [besides 'Thousand Miles'] since i started playing the piano May of last year. i knew what i was facing, but i was willing to challenge myself. but i'm glad i did, b/c i caught on rather fast. it was hard at first, and i didn't know if i was ready, but i was determined to learn the song. now i've learned it, so i no longer envy Vanessa.
-so the bottom line is don't panic or get frustrated if you can't really play it exactly like Vanessa does; you can just add your own flavor to it, like she did for her Sessions performance, and i did, too, since i can't really figure out some of the exact notes.
-and one more thing before i go: go to Musicnotes.com and slow the speed down when you test-drive the song, so you'll know exactly how it's played; transpose it if you want to. that's how i learned how to play the song. the SCORCH program is a godsend, and i don't know what i would've done without it.
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Oh cool, thanks , I didn't know it was on musicnotes
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Hm, I'd say Papa is her hardest.. but she plays it slow on Harmonium.. so at that tempo it isn't so bad..
Amanda
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so far that song's is the fastest and most difficult song i've encountered [besides 'Thousand Miles']
Are you serious? ATM is just a bunch of octaves and arpeggiations :?
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so far that song's is the fastest and most difficult song i've encountered [besides 'Thousand Miles']
Are you serious? ATM is just a bunch of octaves and arpeggiations :?
Some people haven't developed their muscles to the point where they can do that kind of thing at the required speed.
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Oh. I guess I just always thought it was easy because it was the second song I ever learned on piano and I taught myself.
As far as muscles go, I think White Houses is harder.
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THE HARDEST SONG IS PROVABLY ( FOR ME ) HALF A WEEK BEFORE THE WINTER...
PAPA ITS PRETTY EASY (ONCE U GET IT HEHE)
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Are there any harder, though? I haven't tried to play all her songs. I thought Half A Week sounded really hard until I learned it and it's not too bad.
Streets :wink: I don't know if you had covers in mind but its got to be up there!
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Oh. I guess I just always thought it was easy because it was the second song I ever learned on piano and I taught myself.
As far as muscles go, I think White Houses is harder.
White houses isn't hard. The difficulty is the change beetween parts. Is easier in B major.
Half a week before the winter isn't very difficult, but it's very confusing.
I have problems with Swindler, with the change of octaves.
Is A thousand miles difficult? It's the first song I learned on the piano. It's very handy to play.
The most difficult song I ever learned on the piano is definitely Morning sting.
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The only thing that was difficult about White Houses was getting my fingers to stretch far enough to actually play it (I have small hands).
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Well, I'm 13 and I can play it perfectly. What is your fingers extension? My extension is about 8 notes.
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i can just barely play 9.
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When I learned ATM I thought it was hard, but I'd never played piano before, lol.... Now it's easy and I guess if I discovered it today and tried to play it I'd see it's easy... The only even interesting part of the song to play is the riff... the chorus and verses are just kinda eh.
I think San Francisco is the most tiresome song to play; even though its not hard my hand is just like come on this is too monotonous. I hate playing that song, it's not even interesting.
If anyone knows the song, I've found "As You Sleep" by Something Corporate to be really GOOD for hand excercise. The chorus used to be too fast for me to play bc it's a whole octave extension unlike wanted or most V songs. I had to work myself up to being able to play that fast with my thumb and pinky an octave apart paddling back and forth (well, it feels like paddling). I figured I'd never be able to do it since he's a boy and probably has bigger hands, but I practiced a bit and now I can do it and it's really good as a warm-up. Plus it's a really pretty song :)
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I agree with you noelle...san francisco makes my hands sooooooooooo tired... especially after you repeat the verses over and over .....
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I think White Houses is hard. Not the notes. Just, by the time I get to the bridge, my arms/wrists are KILLING me. -__-;;; SO hard to play because of that. Doesn't help that I have a habit of playing Wanted and then White Houses. So my wrists are just...owwww...
But yeah, hardest to play, notewise, for me is Papa. I'm not familiar with the key, plus the rhythm is weird at some parts. I've got my own version which is slightly off/improvised, but it's REALLY hard to play like her.
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i can just barely play 9.
Barely? I'd like to play 9! It's incredible. In June I could just play 7, but this summer my fingers grow and now I can play 8, but it's not better. What can you play with that extension? If a could play 9 I'd play songs like The way it is (Bruce Hornsby and the range).
Anyway, to play Vanessa's songs with 7 notes it's enough.
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Oh, we're not on the same page. I meant I can play an interval of 9, which would be one more than an octave. But I can only BARELY play it.
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Some people haven't developed their muscles to the point where they can do that kind of thing at the required speed.[/quote]
well, not long ago, i though i would never learn the song, [b/c the there were so many sixteenth and eighth notes mixed together, not to meniton that there were so far apart, considering my small, slender hands] but i know the entire song now, and i've even improvised some, b/c i don't know the exact notes; i'll have to go to VanessaCarlton.info to check out the notes on the more accurate transcribsion of 'A Thousand Miles' that someone cooked up. some of the notes i learned from her video.
but one day, i decided to learn that song that i printed out 9 months before, b/c i was determine to learn it, if it was the last thing i do. and one day i decided to learn it, and it just came to me, just like that, much to my suprise. i could learn it; it just wasn't time. and now, i love playing it so much, i play it over and over. and i have to say, you get quite a workout playing that song, b/c of all of it's fast notes. but i love it though, even though i have probably drove the janitors and other folks that come to the music building [b/c i don't have a piano at home] on a regular basis crazy.
even one of the janitors told me that i did great on the song, b/c she recognized it from the motion picture [that was released last summer] 'White Chicks', but didn't know who sang it, so i told her who did, since she didn't know who sang it, much less who Vanessa Carlton is [much to my embarassement.] but i was flattered and said 'thank you'.
but it only took me only a couple of weeks to learn the song, and it probably didn't take long, b/c i've heard it a zillion times over the past few years, and have wanted to play the song on piano for just as long, and i finally have! if you told me back in '02 that i would have, then i woulda thought you was crazy. :)
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I always find it easier and definitely way more fun to learn a song I'm interested in :)
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lol. If Vanessa songs make your hands tired you guys need to bulk up...
one word... Hanon
I play #'s 1-8 consecutavely at a quarter note=100. Now that's tiring..
Amanda
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i have just recently learned how to play ATM and boy do my wrists ache after im done!!! The part when she sings AND I NEED YOU, AND I MISS YOU, you hear the violins tripple the notes, but when she plays it on sessions on AOL and in live preformances, she holds the notes. Don't know what to do....
what do u all think
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In the house of blues (2002) she tripples the notes.
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i have just recently learned how to play ATM and boy do my wrists ache after im done!!! The part when she sings AND I NEED YOU, AND I MISS YOU, you hear the violins tripple the notes, but when she plays it on sessions on AOL and in live preformances, she holds the notes. Don't know what to do....
what do u all think
I've heard her play it both ways solo, but she never triples the notes when she's playing with accompaniment. In fact, she never tripled those notes until after the 'Be not Nobody' version of the song was recorded, where the strings do so. The version from 'Rinse' did not triple those notes. I think we can thank Ron Fair for that little addition. :wink:
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I'm sorry, but playing piano shouldn't make your hands/arms sore if you're using the right muscles. You have to like, use your arm to weigh into the keys. :oops: I don't know how to describe, I just know I was taught that way. Wanted is the closest I get to being sore.
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I love White Houses and it's probably the easiest Vanessa song for me to play, since it was the first one I really learned. Papa was tough to learn, but now it's easy for me since I had to practice my butt off to get it perfect for a school performance. I practiced so much my fingers started bleeding!!! lol j/k!
The hardest for me is Morning Sting. I can't even figure out what rhythm she's playing half the time.
I practice all the time, but I can't improve my strength because I own a really crappy keyboard. So I do start to hurt pretty fast when I'm lucky enough to get my hands on a real piano. If I had a better piano (I'm working on getting one) I'd probably improve. I'm self-taught so I'd need one I could really practice building up strength on.
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well, you could do like i did. go to a local music building that's part of a college or university- that is if you have one within your town, city, or entire county. that's how i got free access to a piano, and i've been playing ever since. my strength, flexibility, and overall ability has improved signifigantly over the past year. :wink: but i must warn you; it might be different in your area, b/c they may not allow you to come and go as you please.
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ooh thanks, that's a cool idea! I didn't know I could do that. I'll see if I can do something like that.
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...but there's only one problem; since the pianos belong to the school and not certain individuals, they tend to get neglected and are kinda outta tune. i just hate that. not only that, the action [and pedal] is sluggish, therefore making me work harder, so i'm kinda tense after a playing session. so i just choose the best one they have, even though it's not always availible, b/c the room's either locked, or is occupied by some idoit who doesn't even play the piano most of the time. but even the best ones in the building have something amiss about them, b/c the humidity's unstable most of the time.
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beggars can't be choosers. I'd play a piano just to play it, even if it was out of tune. my keyboard is really nice, but there's nothing like playing a real piano.
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well said. i suppose playing a keyboard ain't really the same as playing a piano, b/c painos have weighted action [and keys], which is good for your fingers [and arms, too]. classically-trained pianists need that kind of disipline. that's why i prefer an acoustic piano to an electronic on any day.
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Yeah it drives me nuts that I can't play softly vs. loudly on my keyboard. All the notes are the same volume.
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Today I went to a nearby university and I got to play a grand piano for hours! It was so great. And I think my technique has improved because my arms didn't get tired. Now, all I need is to be able to play more songs. lol
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Yeah it drives me nuts that I can't play softly vs. loudly on my keyboard. All the notes are the same volume.
My keyboard has finger sensetivness.. tis great 8)
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:evil:
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:evil:
muahaha
*gives keyboard*
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awwww thanks Jamie lol
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I think people need to stop being condescending about things in this thread. If you can play fancy classical pieces and you've been classically trained, good for you, but not everyone here has or wants to be. Some people play for fun and enjoyment. I have never taken lessons bc I don't want it to become like a chore, something I have to keep up with bc I would then lose interest. And I only want to learn songs that I enjoy and want to sing along with...
Also, some people just don't have the dexterity for fast playing. My mom took piano lessons for 9 years and she has trouble playing things as fast as I do and I've never been taught the "right" way to do it. Some people are just more naturally inclined to be able to move their fingers quickly. My mom's hands get cramped up when she tries. My hands do the same if I play the same notes over and over for a long period of time, but I can usually get through the song without much of a problem. Also, I'm sure somebody with carpal tunnel would have a problem playing fast no matter how great they were taught...... :roll:
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Yeah I totally agree with Noelle.
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Yeah I totally agree with Noelle.
ditto
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Today I went to a nearby university and I got to play a grand piano for hours! It was so great. And I think my technique has improved because my arms didn't get tired. Now, all I need is to be able to play more songs. lol
well, that's what i've been doing since May of last year, after someone told me where the college music building was. i play the grands most of the time, b/c they have a better, robust sound than the uprights. [nothing against them.] i started playing fast stuff only 3 months ago.
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Hi,
Use have all said that Papa is the hardest. I am learning to play it but I only have 1 sheet. Can somebody pleaseeeee send me the full version of Papa. I will be so grateful!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jon.
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http://forums.nessaholics.com/viewtopic.php?p=155490#155490
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Today I went to a nearby university and I got to play a grand piano for hours! It was so great. And I think my technique has improved because my arms didn't get tired. Now, all I need is to be able to play more songs. lol
well, that's what i've been doing since May of last year, after someone told me where the college music building was. i play the grands most of the time, b/c they have a better, robust sound than the uprights. [nothing against them.] i started playing fast stuff only 3 months ago.
grands have a heavier action than uprights, and are therefore harder to play because they cause more strain on your hands if you're not used to it.
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Well.. the thing is, if you are like her and have been classically trained for 10-20 years, you won't find ANYTHING she plays difficult. Go and learn and bunch of classical music, and this stuff will just fall under your fingers!
Learn the greats! Learn Chopin, Debussy, Mozart, Beethoven...
:D :razz:
=Baronessa/PianoBea
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I have to say that my technique and skills have improved since I last posted in this thread. I've also learned a few more songs on the piano. To challenge myself more, I learned part of Alicia Keys' 'Harlem's Nocturne', which is a classical piece somewhat, on the piano. I only learned in a few days.
Anyway, the hardest Vanessa songs to play so far is Who's To Say [the piano rhythm and riffs were so tricky that it took several months to figure the song out] and Papa. I printed out only the first page of WTS and learned the rest by ear. I only printed out the first 2 pages of Papa and learned the rest by ear. On most of V's songs I don't play the songs exactly like she plays them; I add my own flavor to them. i.e., I created a jazzy rendition of 'Red Ditty'.
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Well.. the thing is, if you are like her and have been classically trained for 10-20 years, you won't find ANYTHING she plays difficult. Go and learn and bunch of classical music, and this stuff will just fall under your fingers!
DITTO
Anyway, the hardest Vanessa songs to play so far is Who's To Say [the piano rhythm and riffs were so tricky that it took several months to figure the song out] and Papa. I printed out only the first page of WTS and learned the rest by ear. I only printed out the first 2 pages of Papa and learned the rest by ear. On most of V's songs I don't play the songs exactly like she plays them; I add my own flavor to them. i.e., I created a jazzy rendition of 'Red Ditty'.
learn some scales and who's to say becomes a piece of cake :)
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i still can't believe someone would write a piece of music they can't even play themselves...
hopefully she is working at it (and not throwing shit around cause she is frustrated)
i really really really really want to hear blue ditty...
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she can probably play "blue ditty". she's been playing piano for over 20 years. she plays the classical stuff, which i'm sure is a lot harder then "blue ditty" :roll:
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I know the last post on this was months ago but I just found it lol. Hardest Vanessa song to play is probably, imo, Annie.
The second verse of Wanted took me ages to get, and I still screw it up most of the time :|
Papa is difficult too (lol maybe I'm just really bad), I'm okay it at now but I still usually play the ascending part after the verse twice for some reason and can't move up and down octaves quick enough :oops:
White Houses (not the song book version, I think the version she plays live is better) is quite easy to play and a lot of fun but hurts my wrists if I play it more than once :roll: .
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I know the last post on this was months ago but I just found it lol. Hardest Vanessa song to play is probably, imo, Annie.
The second verse of Wanted took me ages to get, and I still screw it up most of the time :|
Papa is difficult too (lol maybe I'm just really bad), I'm okay it at now but I still usually play the ascending part after the verse twice for some reason and can't move up and down octaves quick enough :oops:
White Houses (not the song book version, I think the version she plays live is better) is quite easy to play and a lot of fun but hurts my wrists if I play it more than once :roll: .
"annie" is ok for me.
i remember "san francisco" KILLING my hands. they would ache half way through the song.
i can't play the second verse of "wanted". it's too complicated. i just play it how it is on the first one lol...
"papa" i thought was gonna be hard, but it's not so bad once you get your fingers used to it.
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that picture... ^^^ for your avatar is from the video that I pored over endlessly and eventually learned her version of white houses from it. does anybody have a link to that vid? it must have been a couple years ago that I saw it...
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Don't have a link to it but I think I saw it on Youtube if that helps :D
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i uploaded the video on youtube somewhere :)
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Ah! Youtube!! How do I always forget that place exists? oh wait... now i remember why i forget. :razz: Thanks
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for me:
papa
the end of swindler
Most annoying(aching for my fingers:
San Francisco
White Houses
Funnest to play:
C'est la vie- love it
Wanted- love the fastness
Easiest:
The Wreckage
Devil Dance
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Hardest:
papa
Sanfransisco does hurt! But my friend can't even get past the first line. :P
A thousand miles + wanted have to be my favourites to play.
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for me the hardest is: half a week before the winter :? I just can't play it
the easiest is: twilight & she floats
the funniest to play is definitly a thousand miles
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hardest: annie, half a week..., wanted (second verse)
easiest: twilight, ordinary day,
annoying: san francisco (aches my arms)
funnest: white houses, time is on my side, a thousand miles
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ggggrrrrrr :twisted:
the hardest for me is rinse(it gets all my fingers muddled up lol)
Paradise solo parts(thou ive got tht now)
dark carnivale is hard to play and sing
My fun 1s are afterglow,white houses, twilight, san fran (love the melody), wanted
lee
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Hardest: Half A Week (Yeah, I know. But I've only been playing since January)
Easiest: Ordinary Day
Most Fun: A Thousand Miles
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Easiest: Afterglow [at least I can get through this one w/o mistakes] and The Wreakage [I can get through this one w/o flubs, but it's trickey]
Funnest: ATM [I can feel my adrenaline rushing; can get through w/o mistakes], Wanted [I learned most of the riffs by ear, and this one's appropriate for pounding for your angry days], and HAWBTW [this one's really catchy]
Hardest: Papa. 'Nuff said. White Houses [in both keys, but in different areas]. I can't seem to get my fingers to relax and play as smooth as silk, like VC. Plus the song tires my hands out. Best Behavior [the beggining riffs] b/c I haven't developed suffiecient strength in my left hand to play the L.H. melody, so I quit learning the song. If you're a lefty, then this song is your friend.
Elicia
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hmmm
easiest: ordinary day
funnest: white houses
hardest: papa... it's difficult to capture the natural flow of the song
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hmmm
easiest: ordinary day
funnest: white houses
hardest: papa... it's difficult to capture the natural flow of the song
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easiest: White Houses, Afterglow, PYHOM
hardest: Papa, HAWBTW
funnest: ATM, Annie, WTS
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Easiest : White Houses, Ordinary Day, Twilight, She Floats
Hardest: Papa, Annie (I can play the beginning but not anything else), End of Swindler
Most Fun: Half A Week, PYHOM, Wanted (I play it obsessivly), San Fran
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Im having trouble with the opening of all is well it get me confused lol :?
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Yeah, I never figured out how to teach myself Papa. I play by ear and I get confused. Maybe someday, but I don't play that much anymore.
A lot of people keep saying the end of Swindler. I probably play it a lot easier and different than V does, but it sounds the same and I should write down how I play it because how I do it is not that hard. Kinda fast on the top hand but not impossible by any means. Ok I pretty much play the whole thing with the bottom hand just octaves and the top hand the melody bc it's easier that way. I know V does the whole top hand/bottom hand identical thing... but it sounds almost the same this way.
so... the end begins ordinarily, like the chorus, until the part that goes
F# - F# (or Gb, idk music notation...bottom hand chord, repeated between each top hand succession)
E,G (top hand)
G,A (top hand)
G, B (top hand)
G, G^+E, D, Db, B (top hand)
so that part begins at the middle C area, and after two times I just move my top hand up one octave :) It's really easy!