NESSAholics.com
Vanessa Carlton => General Vanessa Carlton Discussion => Topic started by: Mountaineer on August 10, 2004, 07:15:42 pm
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The nessaholics.
Its on fanscape.com
Register everyone!!!!!!! More promo for nessa
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Awesome. I joined.
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I'm in.
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I REALLY dont like them using the Nessaholic name for their group. It's so misleading for new fans.
But none-the-less, I joined their damn group.
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joined too.
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I REALLY dont like them using the Nessaholic name for their group. It's so misleading for new fans.
But none-the-less, I joined their damn group.
I know! Everyone who put so much hard work into this place- i feel like they've ripped you off, and its insulting- especially as we were the 'Unofficial Fan Club' anyway. I bet they just came over here and nicked the name.
Regardless, its clear there's a new team behind all of this and that someone is actually doing graphics/emails/promo and i can't complain about that, its about damn time!
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on the main Vanessa page of that site, anyone notice they have a cover shot of Harmonium? Its the same picture as White Houses but with the album title.
Wonder how legit that is or if its just temp artwork.
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on the main Vanessa page of that site, anyone notice they have a cover shot of Harmonium? Its the same picture as White Houses but with the album title.
Wonder how legit that is or if its just temp artwork.
Well the artwork looks temporary to me, buuut she is leaning on a Harmonium, right? So wouldn't that indicate it is at least one of the album pictures?
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I joined, too. :)
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You would think we'd be able to do something about them taking our name since this forum itself has been open since April 2002...
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Regardless, its clear there's a new team behind all of this and that someone is actually doing graphics/emails/promo and i can't complain about that, its about damn time!
After signing up I couldn't help but use the new pic! Nessa looks so cute :P
(http://www.sonymusic.com.au/au/images/myhomepage/myphoto/cadenus.jpg)
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on the main Vanessa page of that site, anyone notice they have a cover shot of Harmonium? Its the same picture as White Houses but with the album title.
Wonder how legit that is or if its just temp artwork.
Well, if you have noticed, they used the "VC font" on that site, as opposed to the "new font" that's used on the promo single cover.
So maybe this is gonna be the cover of Harmonium but I hope not! I want an original artwork! 8)
Oh and yeah, I joined as well! :D
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Thanks for the heads up. I joined too! I'm glad that things are expanding. Although, I agree that it's kinda unfair to use the term "nessaholic" without asking the owners of this site. Anyone notice the term they used for fans after you sign up..it's something like "harmoniumites" (I could be TOTALLY off). Wonder why they didn't use that instead.
Anyone ever use Fanscape before? I read the page and how they describe themseld but I'm just wondering how often they send out stuff and what type of stuff they send out to members of artist lists from people who've been members before.
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I REALLY dont like them using the Nessaholic name for their group. It's so misleading for new fans.
But none-the-less, I joined their damn group.
Agreed.
Isn't NESSAholics copyrighted? Can't katia/Joe/whoever runs the site do something about it?
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Yeah, now that you guys mention it, they totally used Nessaholics without any rights apparently.
Tssk tssk, not nice!
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Isn't NESSAholics copyrighted? Can't katia/Joe/whoever runs the site do something about it?
That's what I was thinking. It seems kinda unfair that they can just steal it :?
Oh well...*joins anyway*
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^yeah, I joined that, but stealing the name....not cool :? :evil:
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The whole NESSAholic use I wouldn't mind so much if they did it correctly. And wouldn't you think they would ask us to help? Like Tricia said we've been here since 02. We are all totally here to help support and that's why we all joined. I just hope this is better then back in 02 when they started something. It was all cool in the beginning then the team just faded and I think that's kinda why we (NESSAholics.com) came along.
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The whole NESSAholic use I wouldn't mind so much if they did it correctly.
For real
And wouldn't you think they would ask us to help? Like Tricia said we've been here since 02. We are all totally here to help support and that's why we all joined. I just hope this is better then back in 02 when they started something. It was all cool in the beginning then the team just faded and I think that's kinda why we (NESSAholics.com) came along.
You'd think...
Bah...I'm such a pansy ass...I joined it too, but I refuse to enter for the phone call. For now anyway...
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oh, and didn't it say something about the first to see WH? The only way that could happen is if they emailed us a link like in the next few hours. Cause I have DirectTV and it comes on at 2.
I don't know that she will actually call, I mean on the other one we did the same. But then again I do and have received calls before from other artists.
But Tricia you already had that honor :wink:
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True
She hung up on me though the first time. She had to call me back lol
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I also dislike the way these things play fans off against each other- i know it is the most productive method but here we seem to work together as a team to achieve things (like everyone voting collectively for TRL, or calling in to radio stations)- i don't like being in competition with people who usually are perfectly happy to work together to achieve a goal.
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i joined, but i'm not wild about the name. What if someone (Katia, Let, etc) contacted this Josi person and bargained. They can use the name NESSAholic, just make us and NH.com the official fan site. That way it will be easier for fans to associate NESSAholics when it's mentioned on the Official Site, and there won't be all this warring over who's a NESSAholic.
I'm so with you Rosie! I hate all the competition. It's great that all the promotion is really starting up, but there's no need to pitch us against eachother, and you just KNOW that the bragging will start up and people are going to get jealous, etc.
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WE NEED TO CONTACT KATIA.
WE NEED TO SEND A CEASE AND DESIST TO THEM IMMEDIATLY.
If we have ANY hope of protecting the name nessaholics then we must tell them to stop using it. Even if they refuse, we must tell them to stop to establish that we are defending the name.
Weather or not what they are doing is legal is very iffy, but if we do not protect the name nessaholics then a judge would rule equity is on their side. If we do not ACT like it is a protect property then it ISN'T a protect property.
WHERE IS KATIA?!?!?
edit: this is a bigger legal deal than you guys are realizing. We must protect the name or else ANYONE can use it ANY time. You want people who have no association with us selling NH or NH.com t-shirts?
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WE NEED TO CONTACT KATIA.
WE NEED TO SEND A CEASE AND DESIST TO THEM IMMEDIATLY.
If we have ANY hope of protecting the name nessaholics then we must tell them to stop using it. Even if they refuse, we must tell them to stop to establish that we are defending the name.
Weather or not what they are doing is legal is very iffy, but if we do not protect the name nessaholics then a judge would rule equity is on their side. If we do not ACT like it is a protect property then it ISN'T a protect property.
WHERE IS KATIA?!?!?
edit: this is a bigger legal deal than you guys are realizing. We must protect the name or else ANYONE can use it ANY time. You want people who have no association with us selling NH or NH.com t-shirts?
I agree that we should at least attempt to stop them because when I signed up I was under the impression it was related to nh.com. I only noticed after that it was a totally different entity.
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but here we seem to work together as a team to achieve things (like everyone voting collectively for TRL, or calling in to radio stations)- i don't like being in competition with people who usually are perfectly happy to work together to achieve a goal.
*feels guilty for the TRL competition*
Pitting nessaholic against nessaholic, fighting for the grand prize. lol
Re: Nessaholic
Unless anybody plans to make any money off of nessaholics.com in the future, I don't see the point in fighting to keep the name to ourselves. With no money involved, what is there to gain with "cease and desist" action? If anything, it will just make nessaholics.com look bad. IM(very)HO
-Kev
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WE NEED TO CONTACT KATIA.
WE NEED TO SEND A CEASE AND DESIST TO THEM IMMEDIATLY.
If we have ANY hope of protecting the name nessaholics then we must tell them to stop using it. Even if they refuse, we must tell them to stop to establish that we are defending the name.
Weather or not what they are doing is legal is very iffy, but if we do not protect the name nessaholics then a judge would rule equity is on their side. If we do not ACT like it is a protect property then it ISN'T a protect property.
WHERE IS KATIA?!?!?
edit: this is a bigger legal deal than you guys are realizing. We must protect the name or else ANYONE can use it ANY time. You want people who have no association with us selling NH or NH.com t-shirts?
I agree that we should at least attempt to stop them because when I signed up I was under the impression it was related to nh.com. I only noticed after that it was a totally different entity.
Right.
See, there are laws that prevent them from using something similar to a name that is already owned IF it is clear they are trying to basically "copy" the branding we already established.
In other words, people worked hard to make the site nessaholics.com a success therefore, even though we don't own "nessaholics", if someone is using "nessaholics" in a way that is similar to the way we use "nessaholics.com" (which we do own) then this is copyright infringment.
It's what stops me from creating an operating system called WinDoze 96 and selling it.
EDIT:
Unless anybody plans to make any money off of nessaholics.com in the future, I don't see the point in fighting to keep the name to ourselves. With no money involved, what is there to gain with "cease and desist" action? If anything, it will just make nessaholics.com look bad. IM(very)HO
Because if we DON'T stop them then Nessaholics becomes public domain and ANYBODY can sell t-shirts, posters, etc with nessaholics on it
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Because if we DON'T stop them then Nessaholics becomes public domain and ANYBODY can sell t-shirts, posters, etc with nessaholics on it
I still don't see the problem. We wouldn't be losing anything.
I don't know the law. Could they build their site up and then turn around and try to shut nessaholics.com down for the same reasons that you mention? If so, then that would be a good reason to persue it further
-Kev
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Because if we DON'T stop them then Nessaholics becomes public domain and ANYBODY can sell t-shirts, posters, etc with nessaholics on it
I still don't see the problem. We wouldn't be losing anything.
I don't know the law. Could they build their site up and then turn around and try to shut nessaholics.com down for the same reasons that you mention? If so, then that would be a good reason to persue it further
-Kev
No. We own the name NH.com and have used it longer.
You don't see a problem with a random nobody who doesn't care about VC selling Nessaholics shirts?
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Because if we DON'T stop them then Nessaholics becomes public domain and ANYBODY can sell t-shirts, posters, etc with nessaholics on it
I still don't see the problem. We wouldn't be losing anything.
I don't know the law. Could they build their site up and then turn around and try to shut nessaholics.com down for the same reasons that you mention? If so, then that would be a good reason to persue it further
-Kev
Well i suppose a good point is what we might gain from it- a link to an proper street team- which would encourage more people to come here and in turn will help vanessa. Also, isn't fanscape a profiting business? Surely its not fair for them to gain money from a name hard-working people here built up for now profit whatsoever?
P.S Your opinion isn't humble ;)
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No. We own the name NH.com and have used it longer.
Sweet.
You don't see a problem with a random nobody who doesn't care about VC selling Nessaholics shirts?
No. At least not a big enough problem to risk the reputation damage that waging "cease and desist" warfare on another fan group could bring. Personally.
Edit: Unless of course the nessaholics staff have any plans to make money from this site (with t-shirts or whatever) in the future. Then I would see it as a problem and I agree with everything you've said.
-Kev
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that's so funny, an email now, just mins. after it premeired.
And I am officially a NESSAholic. That's hilarious.
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Also, isn't fanscape a profiting business? Surely its not fair for them to gain money from a name hard-working people here built up for now profit whatsoever?
I guess you're right, it wouldn't be fair. But, if we were never going to use the name for anything anyway, it might not be worth all the legal hassle. Cease and desist only ever makes organisations unpopular. It's worth considering that aspect I think.
P.S Your opinion isn't humble ;)
Yay. Thanks ;-)
-Kev
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Okay, i didn't think it bothered me that much but the latest email PISSES ME OFF! "The official vanessa carlton online team- the nessaholics" SHUT UP! They didn't even do the 'NESSAholics' spelling right either. GRRRR, who has been doing the dirty work for 2 years? Everyone who made this site, and then they just go and steal it like that.
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I've got to join this thing so I can see what they're saying. Would somebody kindly forward me the last email? I want to see it :?
-Kev
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Okay, i didn't think it bothered me that much but the latest email PISSES ME OFF! "The official vanessa carlton online team- the nessaholics" SHUT UP! They didn't even do the 'NESSAholics' spelling right either. GRRRR, who has been doing the dirty work for 2 years? Everyone who made this site, and then they just go and steal it like that.
felt the same way - this josi girl is annoying with her cheerful-ness and what not - the person running the team should be like - LET... she deserves th' job and is actually a fan not some girl josi that jacked our name...and now intends to tell us we are "officially" nessaholics because she says so - we should be telling her that she is or isn't one of us ... biatch ....werd
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Okay, i didn't think it bothered me that much but the latest email PISSES ME OFF! "The official vanessa carlton online team- the nessaholics" SHUT UP! They didn't even do the 'NESSAholics' spelling right either. GRRRR, who has been doing the dirty work for 2 years? Everyone who made this site, and then they just go and steal it like that.
felt the same way - this josi girl is annoying with her cheerful-ness and what not - the person running the team should be like - LET... she deserves th' job and is actually a fan not some girl josi that jacked our name...and now intends to tell us we are "officially" nessaholics because she says so - we should be telling her that she is or isn't one of us ... biatch ....werd
And 'stay harmonius'? I will be harmonius if i want to thankyou very much- thats if it actually means anything! I really resent being told i'm a 'good fan' by someone random person who is gaining money/prizes/etc from this whole exercise.
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hey prizes i dont mind - they are free to vanessa to give to us - however i will be harmonius ---- if she doesn't use that term again...
xoxo
:D
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Okay this pisses me off:
Until next time, stay harmonious.
Josi
Your Nessaholics Leader
I'm sorry but my only NESSAholics leader is Joe not Josi! REVOLT!!!
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Okay this pisses me off:
Until next time, stay harmonious.
Josi
Your Nessaholics Leader
I'm sorry but my only NESSAholics leader is Joe not Josi! REVOLT!!!
For real. :evil:
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Okay this pisses me off:
Until next time, stay harmonious.
Josi
Your Nessaholics Leader
I'm sorry but my only NESSAholics leader is Joe not Josi! REVOLT!!!
For real. :evil:
Yeah...that's the one thing that really bugs me about this street team. I could let the rest of it slide, but that last line just really...grrrr... :x
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Okay this pisses me off:
Until next time, stay harmonious.
Josi
Your Nessaholics Leader
I'm sorry but my only NESSAholics leader is Joe not Josi! REVOLT!!!
For real. :evil:
Yeah, its like- ummm sorry, do we know you?
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Not only do they jack our name but they don't even link to this site.
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Bandwagon jumpies lol.
It's cool to jump on the bandwagon, just don't try to take the weel and call it your wagon. :wink:
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Congrats! You have sucessfully joined and been accepted into Vanessa's Harmonicrew! Hang tight and you'll hear from us shortly!
lmao. Harmonicrew!
classic stuff
-Kev
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I joined...
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Congrats! You have sucessfully joined and been accepted into Vanessa's Harmonicrew! Hang tight and you'll hear from us shortly!
lmao. Harmonicrew!
classic stuff
-Kev
That it! Harmornicrew is what they said..I was trying to remember that in a WAY earlier post...Why didn't they call the online team this? Oh well. I'm glad her label is at least promoting her a lot more than they did before.
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I joined
ok - so just to make sure i'm reading this right - are we all bombarding this josi girl with emails asking her to stop using the name nessaholics?
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I joined
ok - so just to make sure i'm reading this right - are we all bombarding this josi girl with emails asking her to stop using the name nessaholics?
No. I'm afraid you're not reading it right.
Nobody is emailing her. It would be a very bad idea for people to bombard them with email. We're leaving it for Katia and the rest of the staff to decide what (if anything) to do. I imagine they'll be handling any contact.
-Kev
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I did join, but I am mad...very mad....Very, very, very mad. I say let's e-mail this josi and say "look here...stealing is not nice" but you can be meaner if you'd like to be...
as for selling stuff for profit...don't forget ATR, it's not for profit and it's not the same as nessaholics.com, but when you go to promote it they will say "the NESSAholics." It's very disturbing.
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I did join, but I am mad...very mad....Very, very, very mad. I say let's e-mail this josi and say "look here...stealing is not nice" but you can be meaner if you'd like to be...
That's an understandable reaction, but anybody who emails her will be representing nh.com in everything they say (whether they intend to or not).
It will do no good for everybody to start emailing her at this point (especially meaner/abusive stuff). It can only damage the reputation of nh.com. Please, leave it to the staff.
-Kev
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I did join, but I am mad...very mad....Very, very, very mad. I say let's e-mail this josi and say "look here...stealing is not nice" but you can be meaner if you'd like to be...
That's an understandable reaction, but anybody who emails her will be representing nh.com in everything they say (whether they intend to or not).
It will do no good for everybody to start emailing her at this point. It can only damage the reputation of nh.com. Please, leave it to the staff.
-Kev
I agree we should just let the staff handle the complaints
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I joined
ok - so just to make sure i'm reading this right - are we all bombarding this josi girl with emails asking her to stop using the name nessaholics?
No. I'm afraid you're not reading it right.
Nobody is emailing her. It would be a very bad idea for people to bombard them with email. We're leaving it for Katia and the rest of the staff to decide what (if anything) to do. I imagine they'll be handling any contact.
-Kev
ok. i think it's good to leave it to Katia and the other staff to handle, but don't forget that the rest of us nessaholics can come back them up if they need us to :wink: you saw joey's post, he's angry with the passion of a thousand suns, i'm sure he'd have no problem :razz: [/i]
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you just KNOW that the bragging will start up and people are going to get jealous
Seems to be a recurring theme :P At least the NH domain name is safe :wink:
(http://www.sonymusic.com.au/au/images/myhomepage/myphoto/cadenus.jpg)
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we should leave to the staff. But remember this is all for Nessa. Do all the promotion as posible. Just promote ppl!!!! We are already NESSAholics. Dont let some stupid josi whatever her mane is girl stop you from promoting Nessa.
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i joined aswel , but is it me or do you only get e-mails from them???
dont they have a fansite that you can visit???
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i dont think they meant anything by saying nessaholics.
just that you're special or something.
whatever
look! the site's been hacked! (https://secure.fanscape.com/home/signup.aspx?band=VANESSACARLTON&background=&headerurl=https://secure.fanscape.com/noheader.htm&textcolor=ccff0c&fontsize=2&face=verdana,helvetica,arial&bgcolor=FFCC00&framerows=0&source=streetlink&requiredtextcolor=CCFF00&requiredtextcolorin=and%20only%20in%20your%20imaginations<br><br><center><b>please%20dont%20call%20me%20a%20little%20munchinkin<br>HEHEEHHEHE<BR>SEX!!!!!!!!!<BR>LOLOMGWTF!!!!1111one1!<br><marquee>...i%20dislike%20elephangahantz) :roll:
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look! the site's been hacked! (https://secure.fanscape.com/home/signup.aspx?band=VANESSACARLTON&background=&headerurl=https://secure.fanscape.com/noheader.htm&textcolor=ccff0c&fontsize=2&face=verdana,helvetica,arial&bgcolor=FFCC00&framerows=0&source=streetlink&requiredtextcolor=CCFF00&requiredtextcolorin=and%20only%20in%20your%20imaginations<br><br><center><b>please%20dont%20call%20me%20a%20little%20munchinkin<br>HEHEEHHEHE<BR>SEX!!!!!!!!!<BR>LOLOMGWTF!!!!1111one1!<br><marquee>...i%20dislike%20elephangahantz) :roll:
LOL!
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LMAOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
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I knew right away when I got that email last night saying to join the "Nessaholic team" that everyone would piss their pants. It's just a name, come on. I guess you guys should copyright it, then donald trump can copyright 'you're fired' and conan can copyright 'hush babies' and whatever the hell else he says. Infact, no, nevermind. :roll:
Edit...Don't throw it at this "josi" person..Odds are it was set up by the label and she is just incharge of keeping order.
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I knew right away when I got that email last night saying to join the "Nessaholic team" that everyone would piss their pants. It's just a name, come on. I guess you guys should copyright it, then donald trump can copyright 'you're fired' and conan can copyright 'hush babies' and whatever the hell else he says. Infact, no, nevermind. :roll:
Edit...Don't throw it at this "josi" person..Odds are it was set up by the label and she is just incharge of keeping order.
Well it would be like if some label or whoever came and just jacked the name of whatever the LP people call their fan group who promotes, etc. that isn't an official group. I'm sure some of them would be angry too. It's not a matter of people being greedy about the name really, it is just kind of insulting that they'd call themselves the neassholics group too and create massive confusion for people new to V's music and act like the fan group here doesn't even exsist.
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I don't like them using the term so freely one bit. If you say we should leave it on the staff's hands, then fine, so long as they actually clear this up. If help is needed though, we are all here to make ourselves heard anytime.
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I knew right away when I got that email last night saying to join the "Nessaholic team" that everyone would piss their pants. It's just a name, come on. I guess you guys should copyright it, then donald trump can copyright 'you're fired' and conan can copyright 'hush babies' and whatever the hell else he says. Infact, no, nevermind. :roll:
Edit...Don't throw it at this "josi" person..Odds are it was set up by the label and she is just incharge of keeping order.
um...a phrase and a fan base are 2 different things...
also, we're throwing it at this Josi because she signed the e-mail "Nessaholics Leader."
They know about NESSAholics.com, the know that the dedicated fans are here...they know this (you can say they don't all you want, they do.). It's unfair that they don't make us official and then go and use the name as if we don't exist. There are a lot of things that people do/have done to keep up the nh.com stuff...It's just unfair for them use it in the fashion that they have.
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I knew right away when I got that email last night saying to join the "Nessaholic team" that everyone would piss their pants. It's just a name, come on. I guess you guys should copyright it, then donald trump can copyright 'you're fired' and conan can copyright 'hush babies' and whatever the hell else he says. Infact, no, nevermind. :roll:
Edit...Don't throw it at this "josi" person..Odds are it was set up by the label and she is just incharge of keeping order.
um...a phrase and a fan base are 2 different things...
Yes, they're different. Let me tell you HOW different. A phrase is intellectual property and can, therefore, fall under the protection of copyright. A fan base belongs to no one and is NOT intellectual property, a fan base cannot be copyright. So you kinda argued against your own point.
But, correct me if I'm wrong, neither of us are especially learned in IP, so we'll leave the matter to those who are.
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but a name for a fan base can be copyrighted.
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but a name for a fan base can be copyrighted.
I understand that, I was just commenting on what you said about phrases. I have no stong feelings on the matter of the Nessaholics v. NESSAholics street team thing. It's not even that original. :wink:
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See, there are laws that prevent them from using something similar to a name that is already owned IF it is clear they are trying to basically "copy" the branding we already established.
In other words, people worked hard to make the site nessaholics.com a success therefore, even though we don't own "nessaholics", if someone is using "nessaholics" in a way that is similar to the way we use "nessaholics.com" (which we do own) then this is infringment.
It's what stops me from creating an operating system called WinDoze 96 and selling it.
I agree. Remember last year when Microsuck tried to take mikerowesoft.com away from a guy named Mike Rowe because it was supposedly infringing on their trademark? Although, it looks like MS failed because his site still exists, but I suppose that it's because that is his name. This IS quite different though because they are blatantly using the exact same name and benefiting from all the hard work that we did. Bastards!
Think of this though, Vanessa has used the term in interviews and in posts... What if it was her idea? We certainly couldn't deny her from using it freely. :? Just a thought.
Okay this pisses me off:
Until next time, stay harmonious.
Josi
Your Nessaholics Leader
I'm sorry but my only NESSAholics leader is Joe not Josi! REVOLT!!!
For real. :evil:
LOL! LMAO! Thanks for remembering me, guys! :)
-Joe
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it's good to see old faces. We miss them.
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we do, we do...
*waves to Joe now that he's here*
:)
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Ok, to clear somethings up...
YOU CANNOT COPYRIGHT A NAME!.
Everywhere in this thread where "copyright" has been used, you can substitute "trademark." They are completely different concepts!
That is all.
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
dork.
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
dork.
Ouch. That's it, the final straw, I'm permanently leaving the nessaholics™ to become a fully fledged member of the harmonicrew.
See you in court.
-Kev
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
Ditto!! :D
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
Ditto!! :D
dork
-Kev
;-)
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
Ditto!! :D
dork
-Kev
;-)
LMAO!
The link at the top where it tells you what group and sub group your posting in, now says Nessahlics.comTM ...
funny ... :-)
anyway, the point is that nessahlics.com is a name that belongs to the hard-core super fans ... yes, i'm bias yes i'm selective and choosy ... but, it belongs to the people that while Vanessa was dormant, they were waiting and listening for any sign, any news, coming up with ideas and things to keep on the back burner for a full fledged assault when harmonium finally was released. For 2 years, they continued to check the O-boards, and looked for clippings on VC, and other things. For 2 years, they tried to re-inspire the old love and bond and connection. for 2 years, thy continued the close connection they had with other nessaholics ... which is also what kept the nessholicness alive.
Nessaholics isn't JUST a name ... it represents people who are loyal and dedicated and not only love Vanessa for her music, but it's more like a mini-family.
It's not for the band-wagon jumpers ... that finally are riding the wave, and are here today gone tomorrow fans who really, aren't so loyal to an artist! They don't care about the artists succes of failure. They are just ... wishy washy fans They'll like the next big craze ... and that's what they've turned the name into.
Now, the next person that hears White Houses, and says "oooh Vanessa has touched me with her song, I want to be a musician and play the piano" is a nessaholic.
It's just a name after all, but having not asked the actuall nessaholics if they could use the name, and not including them, and not even acknowledging them ... well then they've just annoyed me, and a bunch of other core fans i'm sure ...
Wasn't it initially Let that coined the phrase? And posted it on a poster... or called herself that infront of Vanessa when she travelled 9483275743652190480-2157347 places to see vanessa? And then yeah vanessa affectionately referred to VC fans as nessaholics ...
*shrugs*
nuts to them.
and yes, Joe not Josi! :-)
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They way this is heading, I'll have to register NESSAussie™ :wink: before some
fan base down under starts to produce promotional material featuring it 8O
(http://www.sonymusic.com.au/au/images/myhomepage/myphoto/cadenus.jpg)
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Yay. NESSAholics™ 8)
-Kev
Ditto!! :D
dork
-Kev
;-)
No, YOU dork!!! :mrgreen:
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Silly us. Clearly we're a brand and not the expression of an idea!!
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*waves*
Hey, Joe!!!!
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Let's hope these promo asshats stop being asshats.
What do we want?
NAME CHANGE!
When do we want it?
NOW!
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Ok, to clear somethings up...
YOU CANNOT COPYRIGHT A NAME!.
Everywhere in this thread where "copyright" has been used, you can substitute "trademark." They are completely different concepts!
That is all.
Thank you for clarifying that, Will. I fixed my post.
we do, we do...
*waves to Joe now that he's here*
:)
Hello, Nerea! :)
*waves*
Hey, Joe!!!!
Hello, Steph! :)
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Ok, to clear somethings up...
YOU CANNOT COPYRIGHT A NAME!.
Everywhere in this thread where "copyright" has been used, you can substitute "trademark." They are completely different concepts!
That is all.
It's not the NAME that we are talking about a copyright on. It's the CONCEPT.
You cannot copyright the name of a fanbase because the name is CLEARLY derived from VANESSA CARLTON which gives HER fair use of it.
We DO HAVE a copyright on the CONCEPT of the website and the fanbase and prevent anyone else from using NESSAholics to refer to an online fan team because they are piggybacking onto the hardword NESSAholics.com has done to promote Vanessa.
Fair use allows someone like Vanessa to refer to her fans as NESSAholics generically. Fair use does not allow Vanessa's management to start an online organization and call them NESSAHolics.
So the issue IS copyright and NOT Trademark.
Edit @ All - keep in mind, if we are fighting the TRADEMARK then all we own is Nessaholics.com and if they leave the .com off the end then technically they have changed the trademark. It's the CONCEPT we are fighting for.
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Fair use does not allow Vanessa's management to start an online organization and call them NESSAHolics.
Out of interest, do we know that it is her management that have set this up?
-Kev
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Fair use does not allow Vanessa's management to start an online organization and call them NESSAHolics.
Out of interest, do we know that it is her management that have set this up?
-Kev
I don't.
*shrug*
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I will not say the dorky thing. I will not say the dorky thing. I will not say the dorky thing.
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It's not the NAME that we are talking about a copyright on. It's the CONCEPT.
You cannot copyright the name of a fanbase because the name is CLEARLY derived from VANESSA CARLTON which gives HER fair use of it.
We DO HAVE a copyright on the CONCEPT of the website and the fanbase and prevent anyone else from using NESSAholics to refer to an online fan team because they are piggybacking onto the hardword NESSAholics.com has done to promote Vanessa.
Fair use allows someone like Vanessa to refer to her fans as NESSAholics generically. Fair use does not allow Vanessa's management to start an online organization and call them NESSAHolics.
So the issue IS copyright and NOT Trademark.
Edit @ All - keep in mind, if we are fighting the TRADEMARK then all we own is Nessaholics.com and if they leave the .com off the end then technically they have changed the trademark. It's the CONCEPT we are fighting for.
Makes sense to me.
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See, this was just one big plan to get Joe back ;) lol.
Good to see ya!
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I hate to call you out on this Andrew, but you're speaking out of your ass.
Intellectual Property for dummies:
Copyright protects creative works such as books, movies, software, pictures, etc...
Trademark protects the name a company operates under, product names, or character names in some fiction.
Patents protect methods for doing things.
You CANNOT copyright a concept. You can copyright an expression of a concept, such as an essay on a concept, however.
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I hate to call you out on this Andrew, but you're speaking out of your ass.
Intellectual Property for dummies:
Copyright protects creative works such as books, movies, software, pictures, etc...
Trademark protects the name a company operates under, product names, or character names in some fiction.
Patents protect methods for doing things.
You CANNOT copyright a concept. You can copyright an expression of a concept, such as an essay on a concept, however.
OK, smart guy, you really wanna have this discussion with me? Cause I JUST had it last night with 2 people who took the bar exam a week ago.
Copyrights can protect things like online groups and organizations. They protect concepts put into action. They protect work done. They protect ideas put on paper. They protect electronic expressions of creativity. They protect ANYTHING YOU CREATED AND/OR PUT INTO ACTION BEFORE ANYONE ELSE DID.
Copyrights DO protect concepts but ONLY if the concept IS the product. In other words, if I think of an idea for a movie and tell mybuddy about it and he runs out and has the movie made based on my idea THIS IS COPYRIGHT INFINGEMENT even though I did not have a finished script OR the idea down on paper.
This website, online group, organization and EVERYTHING INVOLVED IN IT'S CREATION is copyrighted. This is the product of someone elses creativity.
Anyone doing something SIMILAR and calling it by a SIMILAR name is obv trying to take advantage of the estbalished copyright.
STOP ARGUING THINGS YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT.
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Andrew, the US Copyright Office disagrees with you. Maybe those people you talked with didn't pass the bar.
Ref: http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-protect.html#what_protect
We're not claiming they copied stuff from this site. THAT would be a copyright infringement.
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Andrew, the US Copyright Office disagrees with you. Maybe those people you talked with didn't pass the bar.
Ref: http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-protect.html#what_protect
We're not claiming they copied stuff from this site. THAT would be a copyright infringement.
Don't quote me the page, son. You obviously have no idea about the differences between theory and practice. The website makes things look clearcut, but the reality is not quite so clear cut.
A copyright protects a WORK. Period. In whatever media the work appears in. This can be both tangible and intangible works.
If my idea is "I am going to invent something to let people fly!" then I do not have a copyright on it.
If my idea is "I am going to use molecular technology and amplificiation of dark matter to create a propulsion system that will allow humans to fly" then likely this will stand up as a copyright LONG before I put it on paper.
THe difference is how specific your idea is and how far along it is to being a finished work.
If we said "Lets start a website full of Vanessa fans called Nessaholics.com!" and someone else took that and used on a VC mailing list before we created the site, we would have no copyright.
If we create a website and call it nessaholics.com and it is specifically used to promote vanessa carlton in electronic media and someone else shows up and creates a VC mailing list and calls it nessaholics, then we are protected under copyright.
Do some research on electronic media law (which is now 2-3 classes in most law programs) and then come talk to me again.
Edit: What you are proposing is a very simplistic view of what a copyright protects. Which would be just word for word reproduction. Think about how copyright laws protect artists from covering another artists work without permission........
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Don't quote me the page, son. You obviously have no idea about the differences between theory and practice. The website makes things look clearcut, but the reality is not quite so clear cut.
17 USC and case law are clean cut on what copyright covers.
If my idea is "I am going to use molecular technology and amplificiation of dark matter to create a propulsion system that will allow humans to fly" then likely this will stand up as a copyright LONG before I put it on paper.
Any work describing this invention would be covered by copyright. The actual idea itself would be covered by patent(s).
Do some research on electronic media law (which is now 2-3 classes in most law programs) and then come talk to me again.
I have been interested in this for three plus years. I've studied quite a bit and have read many law texts on the subject. Come back to me when you can distinguish between patents and copyright. Hell, come back when you can accurately describe to me what copyright is. You're talking out of your ass.
Edit: In response to your edit, copyright controls the right to make derivative works. I am not denying that. If they clearly adapted text or images from this site, they could sued for infringement. Infringement of copyright is simply doing something that copyright reserves to the holder without their consent. Verbatim copying is only one such thing reserved to the owner. Adaptation is yet another. However, YOU CANNOT COPYRIGHT IDEAS, ONLY EXPRESSIONS OF SAID IDEAS.
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Don't quote me the page, son. You obviously have no idea about the differences between theory and practice. The website makes things look clearcut, but the reality is not quite so clear cut.
17 USC and case law are clean cut on what copyright covers.
If my idea is "I am going to use molecular technology and amplificiation of dark matter to create a propulsion system that will allow humans to fly" then likely this will stand up as a copyright LONG before I put it on paper.
Any work describing this invention would be covered by copyright. The actual idea itself would be covered by patent(s).
Do some research on electronic media law (which is now 2-3 classes in most law programs) and then come talk to me again.
I have been interested in this for three plus years. I've studied quite a bit and have read many law texts on the subject. Come back to me when you can distinguish between patents and copyright. Hell, come back when you can accurately describe to me what copyright is. You're talking out of your ass.
Edit: In response to your edit, copyright controls the right to make derivative works. I am not denying that. If they clearly adapted text or images from this site, they could sued for infringement. Infringement of copyright is simply doing something that copyright reserves to the holder without their consent. Verbatim copying is only one such thing reserved to the owner. Adaptation is yet another. However, YOU CANNOT COPYRIGHT IDEAS, ONLY EXPRESSIONS OF SAID IDEAS.
WTF IS THIS ENTIRE SITE BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
WHAT IS AN ONLINE VC COMMUNITY BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
WHAT IS A VC STREET TEAM BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
STOP BEING SO LITERAL. LAW IS NOT LITTERAL. HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO EQUITY!
STOP MAKING ME RESPOND IN ALL CAPS.
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yes..please stop making him reply in all caps.
lol
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yes..please stop making him reply in all caps.
lol
It hurts my pinky :cry:
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He is responsible for his own behavior.
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yes..please stop making him reply in all caps.
lol
It hurts my pinky :cry:
Caps lock...?
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WTF IS THIS ENTIRE SITE BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
What did they take from this site besides a name? Remember, a name can only be trademarked, not copyrighted.
WHAT IS AN ONLINE VC COMMUNITY BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
This community is a group of people. Individuals may express an idea, such as on this forum and on AIM. What they write is an expression of an idea which is subject to copyright. However, community as a whole is not a work. A community is comprised of people.
WHAT IS A VC STREET TEAM BUT AN EXPRESSION OF AN IDEA?!?
An organization that promotes an idea, just like this forum.
STOP BEING SO LITERAL. LAW IS NOT LITTERAL. HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO EQUITY!
Have you ever read court papers? Obviously not. Court papers in intellectual property cases are especially notorious for being extremely technical and detailed.
STOP MAKING ME RESPOND IN ALL CAPS.
You are doing that on your own.
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There are a alot of interpretations of the law, unfortunately. If you/we are going to do something, just tell it to the judge or other authority responsible for the matter, grathis. Otherwise, there is no point to this aurgument --except maybe entertainment.
People have all these great interpretations of the world. I wonder what percentage of the problems we have are based on interpretation of the law.
tylor
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yes..please stop making him reply in all caps.
lol
It hurts my pinky :cry:
Caps lock...?
what's tha-
HOLY CRAP! I HAD NO IDEA THIS WAS HERE!!!!!!
@ Will - Obv, this point is up for debate. And as we are having it in AIM right now, I will not subject this MB to it.
Either way, we agree that the position is sketchy. The question is under which laws.
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awww...you kissed and made up...how cute!!!!
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yes..please stop making him reply in all caps.
lol
It hurts my pinky :cry:
Caps lock...?
LOL- tricia so thinking that- ever since i went into gangsta mode i have been thinking like you. Strange, eh?
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I am the OG you know
;)
You are too funny Rosie...I'm counting on you to take me to some posh shoppes if I ever get my bloody bum to merry ol England. Pip pip <3<3
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I am the OG you know
;)
You are too funny Rosie...I'm counting on you to take me to some posh shoppes if I ever get my bloody bum to merry ol England. Pip pip <3<3
Crikey! You're coming to England old chum!? Jolly hockeysticks! I am very much looking forward to it! You can be sure i will take you around all of Ye Olde Shoppes of London Town. Toodle-oo!
Ahhh, finally- a mode i feel comfortable in! That whole gangsta thing was making me feel mildly illiterate.
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I will not subject this MB to it.
If you must, I was enjoying it.
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My position is no matter what we do we lose. They are official and we are not, and we have to live with that. We will just exist as a seperate entity, doing our best at promoting Vanessa Carlton and supporting her. We are not perfect, but they could help make it alot better. They lose something by not associating with us. Don't you think we would follow their lead, being a group of fans that cherish Vanessa?
tylor
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I am the OG you know
;)
You are too funny Rosie...I'm counting on you to take me to some posh shoppes if I ever get my bloody bum to merry ol England. Pip pip <3<3
Crikey! You're coming to England old chum!? Jolly hockeysticks! I am very much looking forward to it! You can be sure i will take you around all of Ye Olde Shoppes of London Town. Toodle-oo!
Ahhh, finally- a mode i feel comfortable in! That whole gangsta thing was making me feel mildly illiterate.
Rosie - you are too funny!! :roflmao:
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I will not subject this MB to it.
If you must, I was enjoying it.
I'd post logs, but....
a) It wasn't that interesting unless you like this kind of schtuff.
b) I said some stuff that was unrelated to the topic at hand that I would rather the board not know. Personal stuff.
c) Andrew might not like it being posted.
d) It's looooooong.
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Hello everyone. I guess I'm the one being placed in the middle of this controversy. First of all - a massive apology! We're not here to steal names or plagiarize any concepts/ideas. We're in this to help promote Vanessa and Harmonium -- no bad intentions behind it. We were totally scrambling for time this week so we can get the video out to her fans right when TRL premiered it. The name was suggested to us and because we remembered Vanessa using it before, we thought it'd be a safe and cool way to kick off the campaign. Little did we know we'd be stepping in somewhere we shouldn't have. I just want to let everyone know that we have reached out to the NESSAholic staff -- namely Katia. This issue will be resolved soon and it is my only hope that we can all come together to promote Vanessa the best way we can, with all the fans united. The last thing we were trying to do was to divide fans, create controversies, or not give credit where it's due. So again, we here at the Vanessa Online Team apologize for all the upheaval we caused. We've only got 2 months before the new album drops. We should have the name and partnership issues all resolved by next week. In the meantime, I hope you all will join us on the team and help Vanessa debut at the top of her charts and make sure her return is a triumphant one. We'll be doing the best we can and we're nothing without you guys. So rest assured, we're getting things resolved and we're here to help promote Vanessa.
josi
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Thank you for posting, Josi! It's nice to hear from you, and I am with you on the fact that it shouldn't matter about the names and schtuff, we should all have one central goal, and that is to promote Vanessa. I personally think the reaction was over the top. At first I was a little sketchy about it, but it didn't really matter to me. But that's just me.
Anyway, have a nice day! It was good to hear from you.
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Thanks for stopping by Josi! Your post is exactly what we needed to hear...or at least what I needed... :)
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Many thanks for clearing up the issue.
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BTW, to those who think the reaction was over the top, keep in mind that the staff was nothing but confused, if maybe a bit upset at first...I think that's a fairly appropriate reaction considering we've been working this site for over 2 years. That fact notwithstanding, most of us even joined the team when the link was first posted. Like Josi said, it's all about the music.
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Many thanks for clearing up the issue.
Word :)
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Thanks Josi. As fans, we all know the importance of promoting Vanessa Carlton.
I was upset, as I have said before, but I am really glad that Nessa seems to have a good team working with her this time around.
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In the meantime, I hope you all will join us on the team and help Vanessa debut
at the top of her charts and make sure her return is a triumphant one.
We'll be doing our absolute best to ensure that happens! Stay Harmonius :P
(http://www.sonymusic.com.au/au/images/myhomepage/myphoto/cadenus.jpg)
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Many thanks for clearing up the issue.
Word :)
and stuff
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Thanks Josi. I'm glad to see the music will gather everyone of us!!
Hey, I'm here for the French promo ;)
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Many thanks for clearing up the issue.
Word :)
and stuff
Yup.
Cool ... :-D
Nessaholicness reigns supreme once more. :-)
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Thanks Josi. I'm glad to see the music will gather everyone of us!!
Hey, I'm here for the French promo ;)
I'm here for the English promo!
(i'm hoping we'll get a nice list of international fans now, lol)
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Thanks Josi. I'm glad to see the music will gather everyone of us!!
Hey, I'm here for the French promo ;)
I'm here for the English promo!
(i'm hoping we'll get a nice list of international fans now, lol)
EDIT: In keeping with the lay-out...
I"m here for the Aussie promo :-)
AUSSIES REPRESENT!!!
Aaron
Katie
Tal
and me ... Zena
Hey we're only the ass end of the world ... still,
people easily get famous in Australia ..
and things infiltrate REALLY quickly,
and there is MASSIVE potential for exposure ...
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AUSSIES REPRESENT!!!
Aaron
Katie
Tal
and me ... Zena
I must try to find my NESSAussie e-mail listing so we can expand that A-Z :wink:
(http://www.sonymusic.com.au/au/images/myhomepage/myphoto/cadenus.jpg)
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I'm here for the English promo!
I"m here for the Aussie promo :)
You guys are copycats!! :wink:
(i'm hoping we'll get a nice list of international fans now, lol)
Haha! that'd actually be nice!! World Nessaholics unite!!! :D
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Thanks for being so understanding Josi! Good to hear from you <3
I'm here for the English promo!
Me too :)
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You guys don't send anything in the mail do you? Because I noticed you were required to give an adress.
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make sure her return is a triumphant one.
josi
It already is and it's because of Vanessa's quality of work, not because of any streetteam. I'm kinda surprised that V feels she needs an organized streetteam. She knows her passionate fans take care of her. 8)
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make sure her return is a triumphant one.
josi
It already is and it's because of Vanessa's quality of work, not because of any streetteam. I'm kinda surprised that V feels she needs an organized streetteam. She knows her passionate fans take care of her. 8)
Have you ever had a marketing class in your life?
Her "passionate fans" wouldn't even account for 1/100th of her record sales.
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make sure her return is a triumphant one.
josi
It already is and it's because of Vanessa's quality of work, not because of any streetteam. I'm kinda surprised that V feels she needs an organized streetteam. She knows her passionate fans take care of her. 8)
Have you ever had a marketing class in your life?
Her "passionate fans" wouldn't even account for 1/100th of her record sales.
I was talking about promotion, not buying her record.
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Thanks Josi. I'm glad to see the music will gather everyone of us!!
Hey, I'm here for the French promo ;)
I'm here for the English promo!
(i'm hoping we'll get a nice list of international fans now, lol)
Need I say it too? ;)
You know, even if I have to march up and down my city's main street with a huge V poster and have men in white robes drive me to some mental facility in the countryside, I am up for whatever I can do to promote.
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make sure her return is a triumphant one.
josi
It already is and it's because of Vanessa's quality of work, not because of any streetteam. I'm kinda surprised that V feels she needs an organized streetteam. She knows her passionate fans take care of her. 8)
Have you ever had a marketing class in your life?
Her "passionate fans" wouldn't even account for 1/100th of her record sales.
I think he meant that we do enough streetteaming on our own that an official street team is unnecessary.
Quite frankly, I'm in it for the "exclusive" shiznit, even though that's just a low rez video at the moment (for which I have a WAY higher quality rip).
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recognize
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I'm glad everything will be settled without it getting ugly.
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Well that was a lil cheap of them but I still registered :)
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Oh my life
"Dearest Jo!
Today is your lucky day" OH JOY! :)
okay... *breathes* its cool, everyone sign up!
it's time we start our first challenge as a Nessaholic -- let's make Vanessa fans out of everyone you know. :D :D :D
actually... lets, i can put up with the 'dearest', but only if its for such a worthwhile greater cause.
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woot for everything getting cleared up :-P
thanks for posting josi :-)
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/ericyo/1091990797Uber20Jew.jpg)
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/ericyo/1091990797Uber20Jew.jpg)
Well, you suck too! :razz:
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I totally didn't hear Steph say this thread sucks...and she is the only uberjew I know (in a good way, of course).
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i got a letter from the official online team saying that thx to fan 'I Gotta Wear Shades' they changed their name from the nessaholics to harmaniacs
aint that just a good thing or what
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I totally didn't hear Steph say this thread sucks...and she is the only uberjew I know (in a good way, of course).
LOL - I love yas Joey!
xoxo