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Messages - jsbachsonata

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / Sales - "Heroes & Thieves"
« on: November 16, 2007, 08:10:34 pm »
exactly what i predicted. the album is a total flop. sloppy and truthfully not very refined songwriting is not going to make this album better than the one before.........promotion hasn't been that great and the music is downright bad

ergo.... f-l-o-p

Nolita fairytale is the most accessible out of all her songs on the album and I don't see how any other song can make a raise the album from the dead.... there will have to be some sort of special circumstance such as a tie-in with a movie or tv show to really propel her song back into the charts. Otherwise....... vc is pretty much dead to the mainstream industry....I am not counting on a major label album next time.

to be honest, vanessa's is not that interesting anymore when she's a happy person...the drama and melancholy and drive is gone.

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / disappointed?
« on: October 11, 2007, 10:31:32 pm »
in response to the post about a monotone voice.... i don't think you can really characterize music by monotone because that is what you would say to describe speech.

However, I know what you mean. This sort of "flat" timbre that comes out of Vanessa in Harmonium and truly in HAT is a result of very poorly written songs. The range is extremely limited AND the key is often too low to create any sort of vocal richness.

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / disappointed?
« on: October 11, 2007, 10:27:09 pm »
i am glad somebody brought this up. The last time i mentioned it in her album thread people told me to eff off. Telling me to eff off does not mean it makes the album any better. I am definitely very disappointed with vanessa. Was incredibly impressed with BNN

less so with harmonium

and now there's this...... I don't think her songwriting skills will carry her anywhere at this point. She really will have to depend on her promo.

sorry I am sad about this too but the truth is this album is not good at all.

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / The "I have the album" thread
« on: October 09, 2007, 04:44:15 pm »
vanessa's new album is so crappy to be honest.

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her album sounds like crap to be honest. I am thoroughly disappointed and would not be surprised if the album were a flop. Musically it is not very satisfying as her last two albums... just really primitive song writing in terms of technique. I guess all she can rely on is the image and promo she can get from IRV

6
and seriously i would not show the image of a canines-showing, barking dog after a passage of piano arpeggios.............. the director needs to be fired

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / crappy
« on: August 23, 2007, 08:46:38 am »
I was expecting a lot when I watched the beginning of the video. I think it's pretty cool to play on the success of ATM and go from there..... i loved the beginning ten seconds of the video, and everything else was total crap except for vanessa's hair makeup and clothing. The video is too alternative and indie  in its cinematography, editting, and just overall color tones. The beginning ten seconds was awesome because it looked like a great clean cut mainstream music video with an INTERESTING narrative. Now this video is neither interesting nor contains some kind of narrative, however small it may be. Even ATM had a story --- vanessa's travelling around the city (making her way downtown). It is a small story but at least it was something that was simple enough and easy to grasp for a lot of people. The video had very pleasing colors and a very metropolitan meets classical chic feel-- it was very stylish.... but nolita fairytale is a dissappointment to me... not stylish or interesting. It will be interesting to see how well this will be received later on but I will not be surprised if this ends up being a flop......... again :(

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what happened to the nolita fairytale thread? Seriously this forum is turning into a totalitarian censoring area. It's not even cool and quite sick actually. I posted a thread asking about the nolita fairytale thread before and it got deleted as well. I believe it was a totally valid question to ask. I don't think it's right to go around deleting people's posts without giving adequate reason.

9
I like the drum work (just the drum set part not the synthesized reggae beat part). I think it's very sophisticated but still not on par with the drum work on ATM. A lot of people don't notice this, but the drum work on ATM is very complex almost like it has a different line that complements the movement of the song. I think the drums in ATM were definitely what really turned me on to the song... that perfect marriage of percussion and melody. To this day, I still think the drummer on ATM is the PERFECT example of a great pop rock percussionist who knows how to move a song forward. Still haven't found any song to match up with it.

The drums on nolita on the other hand is nothing special but I would say it does fulfill its function satisfactorally in the song. It's pleasant but not impressive, which is good because it doesn't need to be impressive to make the song great.

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General Vanessa Carlton Discussion / "This Is More Than A Fairytale"
« on: June 13, 2007, 07:16:25 am »
noo.. the evaluation of the level of writing in this article has nothing do with Megan's opinion of the song... the article is indeed written quite poorly (i'm guessing a high schooler wrote it?)

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I think this song has a more mature AC sound especially with the instrumentation... "White Houses" on the other hand really sounds like it comes from a children's cd (yea, nessa does have a tendency to write songs that might be too "kiddy")

 I think everything's ok when Vanessa finds that balance between a more rock oriented sound and a female singer songwriter tone. I think production, instrumentation, and rhythmic complexity in vanessa's line  play a big part and I think NOlita covers those areas successfully to reach a more mature audienc.

When i first heard white houses, pyhom, and those linda perry songs they sounded like they came from a children's cd. The harmonic content is too bright.  Coupled with rhythmic simplicity in most of these songs, they tend to drift to the "children's realm". I am sincerely hoping they are not on her newest album.

12
er... i love the song, but I am not sure about the broken lyric fragments and the static two note chord ostinato. I am not sure I can stand so little development within such a short pop song--- it's ok if it's art music but i don't find this too appealling in many cases of manistream pop. There is really no real chorus.. and i am a bit dissapointed about that, but the bridge and part b of the verse is frickin' beautiful. Not having a chorus in a pop song is one of the riskiest things you can try to pull off so good luck to vanessa. Also, I would really love it if she resolved the "tale" in fairytale. Ack it bugs me to death and the word tale seems like it's tacked on. I was imagining the word "fairytale" would be smooth and open as fairytale is a very "pleasant" word.  I would have prefered if she stayed on the same pitch for tale and concluded with the resolving chord after the piano ascending line, so I think vanessa's approach for that word is questionable. Also the reggaeton beat in the beginning and ending is just plain weird..... the whole song sounds like very WASP-y rock-mainstream and then comes in this reggaeton beat.... seriously, did lumidee come into the studio for a visit on the day this was recorded? I would have prefered some kind of piano prelude using the bridge piano ostinato. I am also wondering why in the world nessa would want to start the song on beat 2 of the measure.... just weird and i cannot come up with any plausible reason why that would be cool unless it's just to trick listeners into feeling that the two chord ostinato is very syncopated.

 Man... I really hoped for a straightforward pop song with that great touch of vanessa (something like ATM) but it turns out vanessa is gonna take a risk with this new song (there are many things that are risky.. good? bad?? i don't know). I think this song would sell if everyone just heard the bridge and focused on the instrumentation and very optimistic tone of the song (I really like the optimistic tone). I think these are great strengths, but there are some weaknesses I feel that might not make this song as catchy as it can be.......... so let's see what happens.

by the way, who likes the "hey!" at the ending vamp? It kinda sounds like an avril lavigne gesture quoted from girlfriend :p well, as I said let's see how well this song will be received... ATM is still THE perfect song from Vanessa Carlton.

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Just to let you know, even though i say that Eminem and Jay-z have got the some of the best rap lyric skills out there does not mean I like them. In fact, I hate rap. I am looking more at the music from a critical point of view not a personal point of view.

And I have to agree that rap might not be considered music given the fact that it lacks the element of melody. However, hip hop is expanding and with the small female interludes that are popular in rap "songs" (a shocking paradox), the void in the melody department seems to be fulfilled, though somewhat horribly.

I know people will cringe at this thought, but rap is more closely related to poetry than it is to music. Well, I guess it's just the state of the world that has somehow allowed for this form of art to barge into the music department.

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i agree. It's not exactly great rap either. Jay-z and Eminem have got killer lyrics and rhythm. Channel 7? ehhh... I would say he doesn't sound exactly outstanding to me. I've heard better.

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I am extremely happy to know that Vanessa has finally compromised to further her career in the pop world. Some months ago some people were pouncing on me when I said that vanessa had to somehow change her approach or learn to deal with more collaborations to reach a wider "money making" audience. Now that she's done this I guess everyone doesn't have much of a problem with it anymore :) Anyways, this is great news. Vanessa has really grown the most in this stage and I can see her using this as a great opportunity for her music.

However, I am not saying this song is good. To be honest, I have to say it's a piece of trash, but if people dig it, then good for them-- we all have our tastes and I respect that. There seems to be a trend for low fi, simple retro sound with quite unsophisticated lyrics in the rap world today (e.g. Gwen Stefani, Nelly furtado's Man eater... and countless nasty songs that I am not going to name). As a jazz and classical composer, rap has just been stripping and stripping away so many elements of good composition...

BUT considering the pop world's status right now, I would say Vanessa is making a very smart move, and I cannot wait the day when she comes back into the spotlight. Big congrats to Vanessa.

If you want you can visit http://jsbachsonata.blogspot.com for an in depth commentary on this new song and current pop trends in general... Warning: the blog post contains very strong views and as a vanessa fan you may be offended so read at your own discretion.

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